There needs to be a lot of talk about effective decentralization before the platform risk becomes low enough to entrust it large amounts of $btc or $ltc.
I'll just leave this here, you know what it means. It's not hard to achieve, but it has to happen.
this is the elephant in the room. Why would anyone shift large amounts of BTC with Hive? If one wants to do that one first has to trust/understand Hive and we do have a centralization issue that looks pretty bad from the outside. I guess what will first happen are micro transactions that if vsc proves itself over time could attract larger investors/transactions. It's still a long road ahead of us, but at least we are finally getting the foundations right.
That is a very mature take, the general 'platform' issue is the biggest hurdle to engage with the Hive ecosystem at all.
Due to this, I have been trying to think about 'trust' as a concept too. As far as it goes for my conclusion. Trust is Absolute, it is a Constant, a Decision and a Multi-Party Concept but with limited scope.
Which means Hive has to be absolute trustworthy, to work as any railway for the trustless use of wrapped coins. Looking at the real time witness situation and the size of the community is of incredible importance and even more so their perception to the outside. Something the Freechain documentary totally missed the mark on. In order to be maximum trust erecting, you want the chain to be perceived as insanely autonom and the documentary is suggesting that it is Dan and his free speech loving friends who are at the center of everything. Certainly not wrong, but a message that will get take the wrong way.
but without Hive, no VSC right? While long time Hivers know that Hive's chance of breaking down is very slim, it's still probably a question on someone's mind when they brings funds into this ecosystem. On ETH everyone just blindly (and pribably wrongly) trusts the chain, we have to get to that point at some point too
but without Hive, no VSC right?
Yes, however there is nothing stopping VSC from migrating to something else if Hive were to disappear entirely. If there is a Hive fork VSC has it's own consensus and can help in the migration process to the other fork. There is some protections there naturally by having it's own small consensus.
There is too much power focused, every top20 got endorsed by BT as you can see. His vote is 13.7%+ of the total endorsement of any top witness.
I've had the thrown at me multiple times while arguing for Hive. People in the space seem to at least take notice and care about that.
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BT's vote doesn't guarantee you a top 20 spot. Did they get endorsed because they were close to becoming top 20 or were they already a top 20 witness?
Could someone become a top 20 witness without BT's vote? Absolutely.
Would it be harder to achieve without BT's vote? Again absolutely.
The problem is not enough people vote for witnesses or if they do vote they just vote for whoever is in the top 20 and call it a day.
Another problem is that there are a ton of people who don't care about governance and just only care about earning. Whatever small amount of HIVE they receive is powered down and sold.
I haven't really seen BT powering down.
Hm, no you can not become a block producer if the biggest stake holders don't support you. That is as certain as death on a delegated proof of stake blockchain.
I think showing restraint would good, just don't have vote on twenty or more out of 20+1 Blockproducers if you're a top10 whale. How about 3-5, and keep the rest of the voting power for an actual attack scenario.
But honestly, I do not want to be prescriptive. That is not my place to be at. Every setting is in place purposefully, no accidents here to be discover.
The fact that there is a lot of circular voting amoung top witnesses and large stakeholders and that BT's vote is very helpful, but not essential to get into top 20 or get a proposal funded does not mean Hive is not more decentralised than every other blockchain other than Bitcoin.
The mining process of Hive is naturally more decentralized and very independent from the Witnesses. We can create saving, participate in author/curation mining and get staking rewards independent of staking pools.
Every not whale will most likely not care about this issue. Meanwhile the security of wrapped btc on the VSC side is actually getting hardened right now. VSC and Hive are preparing a hardfork enabling big multi signature pools for additional security surrounding the wrapped Coins.
But the raw fact that one and the same stake votes on 30 witnesses in 20+1 witness system is suboptimal - and easy to fix.
VSC and Hive are preparing a hardfork enabling big multi signature pools.
Please do not confuse massive multisigs with Hive consensus. They are two completely separate things.
I really think none outside of our ecosystem understand how the mining processes of this Blockchain work. You can't just look at the witnesses to understand "Who is making money?"
I think showing restraint would good, just don't have vote on twenty or more out of 20+1 Blockproducers if you're a top10 whale. How about 3-5, and keep the rest of the voting power for an actual attack scenario.
The problem is once an entity has enough power to vote one person into the top20 single handily, they can practically vote out everyone currently in the top20. The top20 have majority control over block production & rewards, yet the actual voting structure encourages a concentration of stake around that top20.
Irrespective of the individuals involved whether it's BT, or whaleXYZ
Very eloquently written and 100% right, sportsman would say a perfect defense is the perfect offense. That fits here too.
Obviously the mining process is not limited to block production with this technology.
Obviously the mining process is not limited to block production with this technology.
Yes, and this is good. Arguably, block production needs to be done by much more than just the top20 as the majority producers.
Hm, no you can not become a block producer if the biggest stake holders don't support you. That is as certain as death on a delegated proof of stake blockchain.
Moving the goalpost. You talked about BT's vote. I am talking about BT's vote. Others' vote doesn't have a bearing on this. You can become a top 20 witness without BT's vote. It is just going to be hard.
Of course, you are not going to become a top 20 witness when multiple big stakeholders don't support you. Why does someone who doesn't have support become a top 20 witness?
That is a taunt, I acknowledged your effort and refuse to attack. My statement remains the same. The amount of effective governance-power projected by BT is extraordinary.
That is a taunt, I acknowledged your effort and refuse to attack. My statement remains the same. The amount of effective governance-power projected by BT is extraordinary.
Governance-power projected by BT is not that extraordinary, you are exaggerating the power BT holds.
And powering down your HP and not powering it up is contradictory to your statement. As BT is only able to project "extraordinary" governance-power due to people powering down and not trying to power up.
That is couple hundred Hive for housekeeping. I want to make distribution adjustments and have some liquid in case Credit-Card to Hive is letting me down. I pay privex and LeoPremium in Hive you know.
Why is it that you feel like that? It seems you want to defend Blocktrades here and yet he would probably not feel attacked at all reading my comments.